gabrielscruff wrote:

Another piece on the puzzle solved... now i have a cool signal chain to give some nice results... at least to my ears sound very nice... this is my very best approach to use sgear and use my guitar volume knob to create sound texture... want more overdrive ? just hit the strings a little hard... sounds cool... i learn a new thing every day...

check this Mayer "tone" ... not exactly the same but with the duke... and nebula... and a few more ingredients...

www.mediafire.com/listen/0bek1gsh47njbfs/DUMBLE+JM.wav

That`s number one rule for having agressive metal tone,or any agressive tone actually.
And good pulm muting technique makes things more precise and tight.

Nice tone.I like it.

Would you try new Amplitube 4 cabs?99eur is know discount price.I`m little bit tempted to be honest.

Studiostriver wrote:

That`s number one rule for having agressive metal tone,or any agressive tone actually.
And good pulm muting technique makes things more precise and tight.

Nice tone.I like it.

Would you try new Amplitube 4 cabs?99eur is know discount price.I`m little bit tempted to be honest.

Tks ! I enjoy this type of tones !

Amplitube 4... well i think new products release this days have a better sound for sure! Compared to the previous versions... i think a lot of people will enjoy this new release since they improved they work around and sounds better than before...
The mesa pack can prove this... since it sounds really good... and i think the new cab section will help a lot of folks to!
I more focused on how the amp head sound and not the cabinet it self... since nebula works better for me regarding cabs... since is dynamic convolution... the cab "breathe" .... and that is important for me...
If some company release a better product only time will tell i think we can have great tools... and if we can improve our sound we can try...


I will try for sure... but i think in the right moment i have enough products and normally always use sgear... since the DYNAMIC ... is great for a more expressive guitar playing...

And with my signal chain i can have a good sound ... and a really really awesome "tube" experience... the touch of the fingers and nuances play a big role in music creation...

if you check my new sounds on my next post you can understand ... take a listen!

Take a little time to read and listen...

if something is always missing is a great feeling when we find that "something" huh?

the touch dynamics in sgear is just amazing but with a little 'tube touch " we can improve the experience...glue the sound even more .... i will let the sound speak for it self...

all clips stealer amp...

TB OFF( oligarc drive > stealer> nebula - cab ownhammer 4x12 )
www.mediafire.com/listen/2twe8szwsn41c8z/TB+OFF.wav
TB ON (oligarc drive >stealer > nebula- scs treble and bass >nebula cab- ownhammer 4x12 )
www.mediafire.com/listen/xu7x9qu437h2vqj/TB_ON.wav
TB SGEAR (oligarc drive > stealer - with proconvolver on 4x12)
www.mediafire.com/listen/vpxr7blc93r5mq3/TB+SG%29.wav
...............................................................................................................................................................

TB 2 OFF (same signal chain from TB OFF but before the oligarc i put the free dallas treble booster)
www.mediafire.com/listen/cblga1wvp1j55a2/TB+2+OFF.wav
TB 2 ON
www.mediafire.com/listen/a0fdcytg51ythtc/TB+2+ON.wav
TB 2 SGEAR
www.mediafire.com/listen/1ahh7ua0elgh0oe/TB_2_SG.wav
..................................................................................................................................................................

since thre scs treble and bass from nebula is a vintage amp that sample the interaction between the eq section and tube of the preamp .. it give a more realist sound and touch sensitivity imo...

from the developer " the distortion character comes from a Mullard ECC83/12ax7 input tube, this is followed by the Eq section"

sounds great with sgear and for only 5 pounds this library does a lot of good work !

p.s - i know this a preamp type of library .. but i think it sounds good after the sgear amp head...

Why don`t you just buy an actual preamp.I personally use Korg TP-2 (instrumental pre)with two 12AX7,and very god hi-z input that goes up to 1mega ohm,so it caches very good high end of guitar.

I bought it used for 200 euros.I had to switch tubes thou.It is the same price as Nebula,but its a real thing.
It really outshines di track giving it little saturation and analog feel.

Hi-z input varies from manufactures,it goes from about 1/200 ohm I`m not exactly sure but gets on expensive gear to 4mega ohm.For recording guitar in needs to have at least 800 ohm.Some Di`s and music cards have very small indepence and di track always tend to sound muddy and dull.

I`m also tempted to buy Nebula in an future,but as I stated in a past it do not work good for hi gain stuff,but for tones that you seek it pretty much doing a good job.

I will listen those clips tomorrow,know its bit a late here in Bosnia.

Bosnian dude. Odakle si iz bosne ? I use nebula for the cab stuff and that is amazing sound. Nothing beats nebula in terms of cabs spec the ownhammer stuff.

Daco_one wrote:

Bosnian dude. Odakle si iz bosne ? I use nebula for the cab stuff and that is amazing sound. Nothing beats nebula in terms of cabs spec the ownhammer stuff.

Pozdrav.Ko da je bitno odakle sam?Pricamo sa citavim svijetom.

Well I`m not convinced for hi gain applications.That thing fizz all over the place.I listened demos from serious metal producers testing them and its nothing but bad,very harsh and unpleasant tones

I never heard the demo that convince to said I wanna buy it.Only for hard rock ovedriven tones,and clean it doing the job well.In my personal opinion.

Now to return to topic.
Listened your demos and you`r right with Nebula and oligarc it openes the tone.

But you can get with similar results with other methods,with finding appropriate ir for the tone,and turning thet presence knob up. Original tone had being little bit muddy.I find with S-Gear there is really no lack of high end informations compare to other amp vst on the market.You can make it make open with good tweaking.

But there is no right or wrong in music production,if it works good why change anything when you find good sounding chain.

Studiostriver wrote:


Well I`m not convinced for hi gain applications.That thing fizz all over the place.I listened demos from serious metal producers testing them and its nothing but bad,very harsh and unpleasant tones

I never heard the demo that convince to said I wanna buy it.

listen to this high gain comparison...

my new approach ... signal chain ... the files are

amp sim (tse) with his own cab...
www.mediafire.com/listen/q13cq0135u3ww58/HG+plugin+cab.wav
nebula as cabinet only...
www.mediafire.com/listen/vnwy2z023cw8xm2/HG_neb_cab_only.wav
nebula scs treble and bass and nebula cab ...
www.mediafire.com/listen/ad6025pkyyz0fax/HG+ON.wav

........................................................................................................................

i need to experiment more with sgear... but im not into high gain... but i never heard such rich sound before...

for high gain stuff... the di track is not mine is from a cool guy from another forum... i think you high gain guys can do a better job tweaking the sound to get a even better wall of sound since this is just a single track... no effects applied only the od pedal from the amp sim...into the lead channel...

sgear can sound really good on high gain territory at least with my new signal chain...

HERE IS A CLIP OF THE WAYFARER...with my signal chain...
www.mediafire.com/listen/277uwff6i78pmye/HG+SG+ON.wav

i don't have a tube preamp to use before my audio interface... and to be honest i don't need another hardware at the moment nebula got me that "texture" really well covered... and with this new approach my recordings are sounding way better than before...

i don't want to convince nobody to purchase new stuff..but this is a keeper... i just want you guys to have such a good experience with your daily recording as mine ...

Mike did the amp head really really really well... i look to sgear amps as i normally would look to any great tube amps... they behave just like they hardware brothers... i think there is a really deep road to go... still sgear gives such a great experience... and joy...

here is the clever guy ...

Everyone who is in metal is familiar with this guy.He knows how to tweak.
This one i quadro tracked and it surelly sound huge.
He is the reason why I bought Recabinet 4.

I still can get better modern tones with it,and S-Gear I leave for some tones that can get into many tones territory,such as progressive metal/rock etc.

First clip you made is maybe bit a too bright,too much presence or something,and other with Nebula I can hear that digital hiss even with lower gain tones.It is certainly there,sound very arftificial to my ears.
Somehow chewing squeeky harmonics appears,then none natural amp possess with higher gain.
At least to my ears.

Nebula is good product but like every gear on this planet it has its pros and cons.

As I said I found those low gain tones you made pretty desirable and organic,but this hi gain,not really.

For end I just want to appoint that no matter how much we have good software still hardware sound at least 20% better then software,but its pretty on its way to become as good as real thing.

Just thinking of tones being made 10 years before it jumped from pure digital crap to still not but almost a real thing.

I do not have any more hardware for studio recording,but I am sure that good DI with higher uF resistance is a must for every serious studio enthusiast.Everything else can get convincing results in the box.
But recording good quallity signal that will catch the actual tones of live instruments simply can`t be replaced with software.

Some music cards like RME,new Focusrite etc has awesome transparent preamp and hi zi Di inputs.
But older music cards like mine EMU 1212M sound very weak without good quallity Di signal in Korg/TP2 preamp.Pretty much big upgrade.
So imho it depends of how good music card person possess.Many modern ones sound good.

Everything is personal. From type of guitar,pickups,cables,and recording gear,and then softwares begins.

Sorry for big story,but I wanna write everything that comes in my mind related to recordings and any kind related to what we written before.

Best regards.

check if with a little post eq they can sound better....

i've posted the raw files with no post eq or effects...

the previous file the amp sim cab ..sounds really bright... but hey is just how the cab sim sounded.. i did'nt make sound bad on pourpouse...

thank God im not into high gain.. cause the medium gain tones and cleans are just fine with my ears... tks for listen and you can say as much as you want at least we are talking and this is good...

2 diferent eq parts... i don't know if sounds that good...

www.mediafire.com/listen/bokqohvt8kh27rh/HG+EQ.wav

www.mediafire.com/listen/4d8lf2ui09f3fcr/HG_EQ_2.wav

Yeah i also felt that the software high gain distortion has a bit before sound like the real deal. It just sound to synthetic and fizzy in the high freq. To get absolute realistic tone without a real amp. A dummy load with a amp head or a preamp in to nebula cabs will give you the best realistic sound. But if you want the whole chain software there is a lot of tweaking that needs to be done to to make software distortion sound like a real amp.

Its not about overall brightness of tone.If more gain and drive is applied it tends to sound very artificial in Nebula.Are all these tones in Nebula?I hear that hiss and fizz on all three clips.

Impulse for hi gain tones sound way much better imho.

Studiostriver wrote:

Its not about overall brightness of tone.If more gain and drive is applied it tends to sound very artificial in Nebula.Are all these tones in Nebula?I hear that hiss and fizz on all three clips.

Impulse for hi gain tones sound way much better imho.

yes the eq files are all nebula...

im understand that "artificial" part of high gain tones... maybe is inside nebula itself... and probably the irs seems to be better suited for high gain .

i just want to learn and maybe tweak nebula to get a better sound... and wihtout problems... because i think that medium gain are just fine...
im not into high gain but is nice to learn more stuff and how to work with diferente guitar tones...

3 clips... what you guys think?
here i use the stealer with a preamp driving the sgear input... with the push switch of the stealer on... and one file3 without the switch...
can you hear hiss and fizz in these files?

www.mediafire.com/listen/s1af6ak5c2untcj/pr+1.wav

www.mediafire.com/listen/qkv4fo3dj1ag75a/pr+2.wav

www.mediafire.com/listen/484qgvn8rcv887g/pr+3+no+push.wav

Daco_one wrote:

Yeah i also felt that the software high gain distortion has a bit before sound like the real deal. It just sound to synthetic and fizzy in the high freq.
.

we still have a long road ahead ....

I do not hear it here.

Its definite that higher gain and drive in amp triggered that artificial noise when passed through Nebula cab(s).

Otherwise with ir`sa it don`t exist.It sounds almost like phasing issue,very strange to describe,but it for sure sound unnatural and digital.

Studiostriver wrote:

I do not hear it here.

Its definite that higher gain and drive in amp triggered that artificial noise when passed through Nebula cab(s).

Otherwise with ir`sa it don`t exist.It sounds almost like phasing issue,very strange to describe,but it for sure sound unnatural and digital.

so high gain triggers the artifacts inside nebula... well i have 2 more files.. check and tell what you think?

1 - www.mediafire.com/listen/4dr41k51d31sh9q/1-+high+gain.wav

2 - www.mediafire.com/listen/mbtct6toa9suxse...high+gain%282%29.wav

tks

Studiostriver wrote:

Its not about overall brightness of tone.If more gain and drive is applied it tends to sound very artificial in Nebula.Are all these tones in Nebula?I hear that hiss and fizz on all three clips.

Impulse for hi gain tones sound way much better imho.

Yeah but that depends on the input to nebula. If you are using software guitar sims your gonna get that fizz in nebula. Nebula cabs reacts much better to real amps and hardware preamps. I can see that i use same settings on my amp with nebula as i do on real cabs.

Daco_one wrote:

Studiostriver wrote:

Its not about overall brightness of tone.If more gain and drive is applied it tends to sound very artificial in Nebula.Are all these tones in Nebula?I hear that hiss and fizz on all three clips.

Impulse for hi gain tones sound way much better imho.

Yeah but that depends on the input to nebula. If you are using software guitar sims your gonna get that fizz in nebula. Nebula cabs reacts much better to real amps and hardware preamps. I can see that i use same settings on my amp with nebula as i do on real cabs.

I could not agreed with that.I have heard a tests with real amps and its there too.
One famous metal producer(worked with Peripehery and lots of modern metal bands),he is actually Bosnian and live in Austria made those tests and said it sounds horrible.I think there are still sound clips somewhere in Ultimate metal forum.

Studiostriver wrote:

Daco_one wrote:

Studiostriver wrote:

Its not about overall brightness of tone.If more gain and drive is applied it tends to sound very artificial in Nebula.Are all these tones in Nebula?I hear that hiss and fizz on all three clips.

Impulse for hi gain tones sound way much better imho.

Yeah but that depends on the input to nebula. If you are using software guitar sims your gonna get that fizz in nebula. Nebula cabs reacts much better to real amps and hardware preamps. I can see that i use same settings on my amp with nebula as i do on real cabs.

I could not agreed with that.I have heard a tests with real amps and its there too.
One famous metal producer(worked with Peripehery and lots of modern metal bands),he is actually Bosnian and live in Austria made those tests and said it sounds horrible.I think there are still sound clips somewhere in Ultimate metal forum.

He probably used all the old AE stuff and not ownhammer. I agree that you have to be carefull with the treble. But there is a lot of other aspects of nebula that make the cabs sound better then tha static snapshots. The first one is the low end. You can not even compare the low end of ownhammer nebula to anything else of the static impulses. Next is the dynamics and after that you have the air between the cab and mic that is really bad on regular impulses. On this importat factors nebula is the best. But i agree that alot of nebula home made impulses suck. You basically only have the ownhammer stuff that sounds really good and the sound is huge. If you dont use the kernel settings correct it will not sound good. It takes time to get the ms of the kernels correct so you can get the best of nebula.It takes time to learn how to use nebula and i think people use it in a wrong way. Even mercuriall cab is awesome and dynamic better sounding then the regular snapshots where you can hear right away that it is a static snapshot.

Hey guys you don't listen to my last clips?

tell me what you think!

www.mediafire.com/listen/4dr41k51d31sh9q/1-+high+gain.wav

www.mediafire.com/listen/mbtct6toa9suxse...high+gain%282%29.wav

Daco_one wrote:

Studiostriver wrote:

Daco_one wrote:

Studiostriver wrote:

Its not about overall brightness of tone.If more gain and drive is applied it tends to sound very artificial in Nebula.Are all these tones in Nebula?I hear that hiss and fizz on all three clips.

Impulse for hi gain tones sound way much better imho.

Yeah but that depends on the input to nebula. If you are using software guitar sims your gonna get that fizz in nebula. Nebula cabs reacts much better to real amps and hardware preamps. I can see that i use same settings on my amp with nebula as i do on real cabs.

I could not agreed with that.I have heard a tests with real amps and its there too.
One famous metal producer(worked with Peripehery and lots of modern metal bands),he is actually Bosnian and live in Austria made those tests and said it sounds horrible.I think there are still sound clips somewhere in Ultimate metal forum.

He probably used all the old AE stuff and not ownhammer. I agree that you have to be carefull with the treble. But there is a lot of other aspects of nebula that make the cabs sound better then tha static snapshots. The first one is the low end. You can not even compare the low end of ownhammer nebula to anything else of the static impulses. Next is the dynamics and after that you have the air between the cab and mic that is really bad on regular impulses. On this importat factors nebula is the best. But i agree that alot of nebula home made impulses suck. You basically only have the ownhammer stuff that sounds really good and the sound is huge. If you dont use the kernel settings correct it will not sound good. It takes time to get the ms of the kernels correct so you can get the best of nebula.It takes time to learn how to use nebula and i think people use it in a wrong way. Even mercuriall cab is awesome and dynamic better sounding then the regular snapshots where you can hear right away that it is a static snapshot.

To sve stoji ali...
I`m still at though that for metal music you need very good guitar with awesome pickups and DI box with high uF resistance input.


It all counts clearly,but Torpedo WOS III to me sounds better then any other ir`s on market.

After you get that well you get great results.With guitar 200,1000,3000$ difference is dramatically huge.
That are my experiences so far.

Reason is simply because hi gain tones sounds are squashed and naturally compressed due to high volume in studio and amps crank up to 9/10.Too much volume attack to mics and distance also is very close.That nonlinearity and details are pretty much lost even in a real world with that settings.

With any other kind of tones I totally agree.

gabrielscruff,these sounds are still very low gain in compare to riff and sound for original song.
With this low it can get decent.

On this clips,yes,know its less noticeable,but gets darker.Not totally gone thou,its still there.
But maybe in mix it will not be so much of it.

My personal opinion its simnply thats how Nebula works.Maybe with good tweaking you can get good result,but I never heard it.I would surelly not gamble to buy so expensive software.

And I`m very picky person.For years (about 8/9 I think ) literally I constantly record guitar tones,with various hardware and software.
With WOS III i can`t hear that anything is missing for hi gain tone,with good tweak.